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Post by Relarz on Nov 10, 2012 12:22:22 GMT -5
I met the guy starting it up when he came into spyops one day to look at sourcing replicas to start up. Seems like a decent guy. The liabilties of the hotter guns is definitely a seriously potential issue, but after playing at all the out of state and Lionclaws events where the regs are much hotter, I have a certain level of apathy towards it.
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PHX02
New Member
Stealer of teh funnehs
Posts: 992
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Post by PHX02 on Nov 10, 2012 12:49:27 GMT -5
I think it is in the best interest of the owners to comply with MIA regulations. CQT had a good thing going with their airsoft field, but they refused to conform to MIA standards. After the first wave of fourteen year old backyard airsofters came through a time or two, they had no one coming to play at their field. I believe they have now ceased operation of their airsoft field, which is a shame. I hope this new place comes through. Looks like it has some awesome potential.
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Post by steelfallenangel on Nov 11, 2012 0:54:09 GMT -5
I don't think they'll outright go out of business. I think this is the field the Detroit Swat team uses as a shoot house.
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Post by M.S.-ARC on Nov 11, 2012 14:32:09 GMT -5
I don't think they'll outright go out of business. I think this is the field the Detroit Swat team uses as a shoot house. Where did you get that information?
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Post by Squirrel on Nov 12, 2012 22:11:09 GMT -5
Buying their BBs is a great little income for them. From a business standpoint, I can't argue much. 400fps with .2 might suck a little indoors, I would toss on my iron face mask and still play though. If it is 400fps with .25s, I would have some second thoughts. I know what that feels like from point blank, and I am not a fan.
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Post by Knief on Nov 13, 2012 9:44:47 GMT -5
Buying BBs is only great from a business standpoint if their profit on bbs offsets their loss of profit on customers. My guess is that it won't. There are a lot of players that won't play on a field that forces you to use their bbs, and that's a lot of lost business.
As for playing with 400 FPS AEGs on full auto indoors, not a good idea. Remember, muzzle energy doesn't scale linearly with FPS. It's an exponential increase, so the jump from 350 FPS to 400 FPS is greater than the jump from 300 FPS to 350 FPS. And from 350 to 400 is a pretty big jump in terms of pain, and more importantly, potential damage. I believe it was Tex who had his finger broken at Farmington when somebody brought a hot gun onto the field.
350 FPS is the CQB limit for a reason, and it's not because a bunch of inexperienced players pulled a number of their collective ass. We knew what we were doing when we wrote the rules, and every experienced player in the state (and a bunch from out of state) had input on it.
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Post by MayhemXXXFrosty (AndrewMp5k) on Nov 14, 2012 21:53:21 GMT -5
It's not even 400 FPS with .20's, it's with .25's (so you gun is actually higher, about 430+ with .20s). I've played CQB with guns running around 400 FPS with .20's, and they've broke skin, shot peoples teeth out, ect. There's simply no need for the extra 50+ FPS. The 350 FPS standards for CQB is more than enough, especially since FULL-AUTO is allowed. Imagine someone running a 430+ FPS gun with a Lipo cranking out 30+ RPS. That can cause some serious damage in a hurry. The BB's thing I'm not that over the moon about, but so long as they aren't Crossman .25's, I am fine with using mid to high quality BBs.
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Post by X on Nov 16, 2012 12:17:22 GMT -5
I met the guy starting it up when he came into spyops one day to look at sourcing replicas to start up. Seems like a decent guy. The liabilties of the hotter guns is definitely a seriously potential issue, but after playing at all the out of state and Lionclaws events where the regs are much hotter, I have a certain level of apathy towards it. Lion claws limits are lower (366 w/ .25) and they do not allow full auto indoors. Sent from my DROID RAZR using proboards
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Post by Priest (Immortal) on Nov 16, 2012 21:15:05 GMT -5
At first I was wondering why everyone was ready to boycott them over the 400fps. Then I kept reading and realized it was with .25's on Full-auto. I'm more than cool with the full-auto thing. I know that they play that way in CA and have always wanted in on some of that action. But damn!! 400+ with .25's is asking for trouble on full-auto in CQB. I'd definitely head out there if they altered a few rules. I'm sure that if enough guys expressed their concerns they'd consider the reasoning behind it and possibly reevaluate the rules. Also, since they are new to the sport. They might not know how to open the gearboxes and make the changes necessary to lower the FPS.
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Post by Da Vinci - Да Винчи on Nov 16, 2012 21:38:00 GMT -5
Although it isn't that big of an issue, I still don't fully understand the "no full auto" rule at most CQB games here. If you're shooting under 350 FPS, and people are wearing facemasks, I don't see why there's that much of a problem with it.
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Post by Pagan on Nov 16, 2012 21:43:52 GMT -5
Although it isn't that big of an issue, I still don't fully understand the "no full auto" rule at most CQB games here. If you're shooting under 350 FPS, and people are wearing facemasks, I don't see why there's that much of a problem with it. Have you ever played indoors? Getting shot 2-3 times at 5-10ft range sucks, now multiply that by 10, and you should be able to understand why using full auto for CQB is just dumb. I've seen broken teeth and painful bloody welts from sub 350 fps guns in semi auto. I have a scar on my arm where someone used a hot gun indoors, and it actually took ink out one of my tattoos. Now imagine you are coming around a corner, and someone unleashes a full auto burst right when you turn the corner. Depending on their ROF, you could be looking at any where from 10-30+ bbs at close range from a 1 second burst. Does that sound like fun to you? I know we are shooting at each other, but being safe and courteous is a better way to play than a full auto spray and pray.
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Post by Myers on Nov 16, 2012 21:56:07 GMT -5
Honestly for the first time ever I have to agree with Da Vinci. I've been shot too many times to count at CQB range with AEGs shooting >350 FPS and honestly getting hit by a paintball hurts a ton more. I do have to agree that honestly semi automatic is much more efficient anyways, but I just don't understand why full auto is banned. Only thing I can think of is if some cock sucker shows up that will empty an entire mag on one person. Fortunately I don't think stuff like that happens much here in MI.
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Post by Da Vinci - Да Винчи on Nov 16, 2012 21:59:15 GMT -5
I haven't played indoors, but I've been lit up, full-auto, from less than 10 feet from a stock 400 FPS Chinese AEG. Yeah, it hurt like hell, and I had welts, but there's really no serious threat there, as far as I can see. I'm not going to start an argument or try to change the rules, I just don't think they're that necessary.
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Post by MayhemXXXFrosty (AndrewMp5k) on Nov 16, 2012 22:10:55 GMT -5
Imagine turning the corner and that 10ft is now 1ft. I've been lit up with full-auto in many CQB situations, and the guns running >350 FPS are fine, and you can tell who's running hot and who's not from that distance. I still have scars from welts I got from hot guns from playing CQB. I play with a full paintball mask, and have seen people play with mesh goggles. Honestly they are asking to get their eyes shot out, even with those new lower mesh masks their teeth shot out.
Even if you figure running full facemasks, moving and looking around, it wouldn't be that hard for someone to shoot somebody in the back of the head on accident or a BB going stray and into the side of their mask opening and hit their cheek or jawbone or something. I've actually shot somebody and it ricochet'd up and into their full-seal goggles somehow or another.
There is almost no tactical advantage for running over 360fps in a CQB setup. Sure if used correctly it can be safe, but when you're playing with different or new people (especially new people to the sport who are renting those hot guns and don't necessarily have the experience of most on these boards) you can run into issues.
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Post by Pagan on Nov 16, 2012 22:11:34 GMT -5
Never thought you were trying to argue, sorry if it came across like I was.
I guess I look at the sport a bit differently than a lot of people.
I would prefer to play safe and have people enjoy themselves, rather than go home injured, or pissed off. I know accidents happen, by why not reduce the factors that can exacerbate the chance of someone potentially getting hurt?
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