Tommlux9
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M4A1 and WA CDP
Posts: 55
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Post by Tommlux9 on Aug 24, 2002 23:42:21 GMT -5
o well in that case i think the unnammed person needs to sell his russian spetz-naz scarf thing and buy him self a 20 doller springer pistol for just that reason ;D
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Post by Ballista on Aug 25, 2002 1:17:01 GMT -5
Yes we ought to start enforcing distance/fps limits. This is just building notoriety for the unnamed person's dreaded AK of doom, which will give him a tactical advantage: intimidation.
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derick
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For a good time call - 867-5309
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Post by derick on Aug 25, 2002 1:37:47 GMT -5
Why keep crying about it and just not let it happen next time? Next time, call "take the hit" and if he refuses, drill him a new one. So my advice, if you hear "take the hit" and try to be a hero, you deserve every last shot. More than likely, if you are close enough to hear it, you better take it or youre gonna get hurt.
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Post by Viking on Aug 25, 2002 7:56:29 GMT -5
For one Newman you can hide behind you didn’t know what gun I was using all you want, but you did. You shot at me multiple times before I got to the fort and if you couldn’t see that it was my AK then you need glasses. On top of that the half hour before that situation I picking people off in the fort from the hilltop should have been another indication. Not to mention the fact you hadn’t heard the TMP the entire game.
I know what my gun is capable of, which is why I offered you surrender. But refusing it was stupidity. And no, I never went full auto on you; I first said that to hope you would leave. I shot your knee in the first two shots double tapped, after I didn’t hear any hit for 1 or 2 seconds I let off the third shot which is when you finally called yourself out.
As for the FPS do not claim its 400+, we don’t know that (thanks to Minky grrr hehe). I highly doubt it is shooting 400+, might be 380-390ish.
Your gun may be shooting 343 but it is still dangerous at 10 feet. If you don’t believe me ask Minky what happens when a 250fps shotgun hits you from that range. Which is exactly my point. You where firing full auto at 10 feet, Robo my have, though all I witnessed was him ducking and rolling for his life, and I was shooting semi way to close. We were all in a bad position and playing irresponsible airsoft. Part of playing safe airsoft is not allowing to get yourself into a position where something like this can happen. Even if you didn’t know what gun I was using and this occurred you telling me your going to take the chance and stay thinking it weren’t my AK? Specially sense I engaged you the entire half an hour before with it? And even with the TMP, you don’t think that range would of hurt? It would of, you would have still walked away with a welt, maybe not bloody but I am sure you would be doing the same thing you are now, complain.
After the game in the staging area every time we talked about the game and I said that I offered surrender your reply was “I know, I’m not complaining” but if you ask me this whole thread has been a complaint. Two faced I swear. How ever, part of me is frustrated on the fact that you think nothing of your actions during that game and that you even created this thread, the other part of me is a bit relived that you did sense from this will spawn many rules for my field. Sense day one the field’s rules have changed quite a bit, from moving the staging area to waivers. All for the best, now we are going to have range rules and surrender rules, and most likely “hot weapons in staging area rules.”
As much as this thread seems to be pretty heated it all for the best in my mind.
-V I K I N G SEMTEX Operative[/color]
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Post by Andy on Aug 25, 2002 9:59:58 GMT -5
Newman, I had a simalare thing happend to me. I was shot at 2 feet away at my leg with my USP P8 at ruffly 370 fps(so i am told).
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omegasniper
New Member
TM Tactical Master and TM MP5A4
Posts: 117
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Post by omegasniper on Aug 25, 2002 11:08:10 GMT -5
Ok, I know the criticism is gonna pour in after i get done with this....
Ok, first of all, I gotta say, there was really no need to make this such an issue. I don't think we should change any rules based on what has happened, especially not the ability to decline a surrender, because I already know that no one is gonna stand for any more FPS limitations, so that issue didn't even spark the slightest concern. Some times, it feels good to just defy a surrender and go all out. But everyone who does that should know that there's gonna be consequences. Very few times have I been able to pull one off successfully. And it's rater foolish to do so, I must admit, but it's not fair to take away the ability to do so...
This thread should have been locked after Viking(a.k.a the unnamed person) got his side of the story in. I don't mean to slam you Newman, I'm just saying that you didn't need to get mad at anyone, you blew this whole thing way outta proportion. You just don't make a valid point. You could have easily prevented yourself from being "harmed", but chose the more risky(I think fun) route. That's all I gots ta say.
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Post by frostee on Aug 25, 2002 11:28:40 GMT -5
I wasn't there, I don't know the situation, but I do know a nice shot grouping when I see one. ;D
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Post by SickPointe on Aug 25, 2002 11:36:36 GMT -5
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Post by Minky on Aug 25, 2002 11:43:02 GMT -5
I agree, this whole thing has been blown waaaay out of proportion...BUT!... It did serve to raise some good points. I mentioned something in the SEMTEX forum last week about how we should maybe think about setting up some ground rules for surrendering. There was a great article posted at www.airsoftplayers.com that pretty much sums up how I feel about the issue. The surrender option needs to be available from a pure safety standpoint, but it shouldn't be so broad that it can become a rule to hide behind. I think everyone should go read that article if they haven't done so already! Also, just from what I've gathered from reading this thread, it sounds to me like Viking did everything right. He gave the option to surrender, and when no reply was given he made the right call and aimed for an area of the body likely to produce less damage. Granted, Newman did end up with some nasty welts, but that's just part of the random nature of airsoft. I'm sure we've all taken hits that hurt like a mother but left little or no visible damage, and we've also had hits that didn't hurt too bad but upon later inspection look pretty nasty. I know one thing after all this, I'm hooking the facemask portion back onto my goggles for the next skirmish I attend!
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Post by Newman on Aug 25, 2002 13:10:43 GMT -5
Ok people, since you all think Viking is totally correct and that I'm lying about not hearing him let's see the goddamned facts. Fact One: Viking has two guns. One is an M120 powered AK, another is a TMP (full-auto). One has a distinctive firing sound (TMP). Fact Two: Viking, Robo, another teammate, Eddie, and I are all within ten feet of each other. Eddie can tell you that he was shot at full-auto through the pallets. I can tell you that I was shot full-auto in the leg (with that big a welt, you think I just sat there and didn't yell out after the first shot?). I can tell you that I was shooting full-auto, and so was Eddie. Fact Three: If Viking was using his AK, which has a full-stock I might add, that means that he'd have to be very close to me or have to stick his full-size gun under something to hit me in the leg, therefore negating any possibility of him supposedly trying to hit me in a "safe" spot (sticking a gun under something and blind firing...?). Furthermore, if he was, in fact, far enough away and below me somewhat, he could have asked for one of his teammates with the unupgraded guns to shoot me in the leg...but in this case, everyone was just gunning at each other full-auto, and I bet he didn't have the time, so he let loose. Fact Four: With all of us shooting our guns, how could anybody be 100% sure I heard him ask for a surrender? How can ANY of you say that I REFUSED a surrender? The only person that we can ask about this is Eddie, who was right next to me at the time (if even that, he could have died right before the incident). Fact Five: People who weren't at the game think they know what happened, and don't. Derick, I think I will "take the hit" from an M120 powered gun from 5 feet if I'm shot once! Fact Six: I saw Viking shooting his AK at me multiple times during that game BUT Viking himself told everyone to bring down all of their guns and gear and put them in their team start points. If I never saw Viking run up to the base (I was behind one side of it and never did see him run up, only heard him yell "I'm on full-auto"), how would I ever know which gun he was using? (there were infinite lives, so he could change guns during the game) Now some opinions: 1. "I shot your knee in the first two shots double tapped, after I didn’t hear any hit for 1 or 2 seconds I let off the third shot which is when you finally called yourself out. " There is no idea how we can tell if you were shooting full-auto or not, unless somebody on either team heard you shooting at that specific time other than me. 2. "And even with the TMP, you don’t think that range would of hurt? It would of, you would have still walked away with a welt, maybe not bloody but I am sure you would be doing the same thing you are now, complain." It's not the hurting I care about, Viking, it's that you mishandled your high-powered AK! I could care less that I got these stupid bruises, it's the whole idea that you blasted me with a highly-upgraded gun that you knew could do serious damage at close ranges (which I found out on this thread). 3. "After the game in the staging area every time we talked about the game and I said that I offered surrender your reply was “I know, I’m not complaining” but if you ask me this whole thread has been a complaint. Two faced I swear. " You never said that, seriously, you never said anything about a surrender. You said only about the full-auto, and I didn't care about that, because everybody else was and so was I. Your two-faced comment is quite truthful, in fact, because I was in shock when I came home and found these two extra (bigger) bruises, and then found out that you didn't give a hoot, and blamed me for it. And just because it's relevant, I'm sticking in another fact: " Part of playing safe airsoft is not allowing to get yourself into a position where something like this can happen." You ran up to the fort while I was there! It was you who put yourself in the unsafe position, not myself! Now, I have already told Hadoken this, and now everybody can know: I am not playing Airsoft with Viking ever again, God help me. Yes, that means I'm not coming back to any game hosted at Viking's Tactical Funland, ever. That might come as a shock to some, but to me, you just irresponsibly shot and hurt me with NO remorse for what happened, and then blame me for it. No more explanation is needed, I hope somebody see some truth in what I said, and farewell to everybody who I played with for almost a year.
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omegasniper
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TM Tactical Master and TM MP5A4
Posts: 117
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Post by omegasniper on Aug 25, 2002 14:23:36 GMT -5
SETTLE DOWN NEWMAN!!!
A GOOD CHRISTIAN SOLDIER DOESN'T TAKE THE GOOD LORD'S NAME IN VAIN!
Seriously, let's all forgive eachother and stop this! This is crap! We don't need rivalry! WE should be coming together as a brotherhood, not dividing! We all gotta reflect and realize something, our great sport has been taking some hits lately, and fighting eachother isn't gonna help!
Viking and Newman: Please try to sort this out.
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Post by Minky on Aug 25, 2002 14:59:44 GMT -5
I really hope you take some more time, a week, month, whatever, and reconsider your decision Newman. I think Viking does feel sorry for what happened, and he's admitted to making a mistake, and has decided to implement measures to try and make sure incidents like this don't happen anymore at his field. I think it's kind of extreme for you to leave over something like this, and (I hate to say this, because I know it'll piss you off) I think it doesn't show much maturity to leave without trying to work things out.
You're right, I wasn't there at the time this happened so going by the only source of information I have, i.e. this thread, I have to honestly say that it sounds like honest mistakes. No matter which version of what happened is the correct one, it's obvious there were mistakes made. The best thing we can do is learn from those mistakes and play in a safer manner in the future. I really see no need for you to quit playing with Viking, but hey, it's your life and you can decide what you want to do. You'll remember that a couple weeks ago I took a shotgun blast to the lips at close range... I accepted that as part of the risk that comes from playing this game, and from me choosing not to wear a facemask. I think you need to just accept this for what it was, a series of bad decisions and mistakes, along with the inherent risk that comes from shooting projectiles at each other.
My final thought on this whole ordeal:
Everyone should have realized there was a higher potential for injury/pain in that type of game, and there should probably have been a restriction placed on using upgraded guns. Viking's had a tooth shot out from a stock GBB pistol, I've had swollen lips from a stock spring powered shotgun....it would have made sense to restrict people to using sidearms and stock weapons to maximize safety.
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Post by SickPointe on Aug 25, 2002 15:03:17 GMT -5
SETTLE DOWN NEWMAN!!! A GOOD CHRISTIAN SOLDIER DOESN'T TAKE THE GOOD LORD'S NAME IN VAIN! Haha I was thinking the same thing. I feel like I'm watching "A Few Good Men" here. DID YOU ORDER A CODE RED NEWMAN?! I WANT THE TRUTH! YOU CANT HANDLE THE TRUTH! ;D
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Post by Newman on Aug 25, 2002 15:57:25 GMT -5
Everyone, sheesh, I'm sorry. Viking and I will sort out everything together, and I hope it'll be resolved peacefully. Viking, you have my apologies for getting mad at you, but when we talk, I hope you at least consider my point of view. Why waste 11 months of MiA involvement (that's the beginning, folks) just because of some dumb argument. Newman out, and Viking, please PM soon.
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Post by Minky on Aug 25, 2002 16:06:44 GMT -5
Yay! Glad to see you're sticking around Newman, it just wouldn't have been the same without ya! Here's my brilliant idea to help minimize problems like this in the future: Everyone must have at least one bone-stock AEG to use for indoor CQB and close range woodland combat. I think it's a winning idea, since it gives everyone an excuse to buy another airsoft gun, hehe. ;D
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