TM or CA FS3 SG1

[aaron96]

Hi was wondering if the Tokyo Marui or Classic Army Fsg3 sg1 (g3) would be a better purchase. I am planning to put a pdi 170% spring, g&p 120 motor, kn 6.04 inner barrel and a systema bucking. The metal body doesn't matter too much to me. And if they need new gears to pull the 170% spring then I would add those in. Thanks for the help.
Links: www.airsoftextreme.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=364_67_536&products_id=1894
www.airsoftgi.com/product_info.php?products_id=1781

[Ghast]

If you're going to upgrade it, I'd recommend using the CA G3. The metal body will be nice after everything is all said and done.

[aaron96]

As far as internals go would I need to upgrade both fully to get to 400 fps or would just installing a tightbore and a new spring be fine. Also as far as performance goes, which one has the nicer internals. The metal body doesn't matter to much to me.

[Alex-(BM_5)]

Stock internals TM will always come out on top but opening a TM gearbox then limits it's life.

[Gimpalong]

I believe JG made a G3 variant with a metal body. You could purchase a TM and then hunt down a JG, swap the bodies and have the rest of the JG as a parts gun.

From what I understand about G3s and MP5s, the point where the barrel meets the body is usually prone to snapping when used... rigorously. As a result, the metal bodied CA might be a better place to start than the TM.

Frankly, you'd probably have an easier time finding a CA G3 and overall the externals would probably be better.

[Ghast]

Apr 9, 2012 10:21:09 GMT -5 aaron96 said:

As far as internals go would I need to upgrade both fully to get to 400 fps or would just installing a tightbore and a new spring be fine. Also as far as performance goes, which one has the nicer internals. The metal body doesn't matter to much to me.

Both the CA and TM G3 can handle a 380-400 fps spring on stock internals for a while. But as said before, TM's lose all value (imho) after they've been opened, because once you disrupt the harmony of the TM's gearbox, it sort of goes downhill. Having said that, since you're going to be opening it up anyways, go with the CA.

[aaron96]

Great, thank you so much. What else should I replace in the gearbox to get long term longevity. I'm hoping I don't have to replace the whole thing though. Also how good are the stock CA motors.

[TheEnd]

I've held and fired a TM and JG G3 and I have owned 2 CA G3's. The TM and JG are plastic, and they creak and flex like crazy. The G3 is just too long and thin to be plastic. With the newer design CA fixed the receiver so it won't snap at the hand guard. The new version is the "light weight" one. The CA metal body feels great and the paint will eventually wear in pretty realistically.

The downside to the CA is the hop up. The CA G3 hop up sucks. It's terrible. I tried replacing the barrel and bucking, but the chamber on mine just refused to perform. The best thing to do is install a Marui hop up chamber in the CA. A used one I bought had that done and it was great.

The stock CA gearbox should hold up to 400fps just fine. I would suggest the standard mods like AOE correction and a reshim/relube as every gear box should have that done. The stock CA motor is a decent performer, but it won't wow you. Swap in a ACM high torque and you will be in business. Personally I like the JG blue neo the best.

[aaron96]

If the hop up is as bad as everyone says it is should I just go with the tm. I don't care about the body too much plus it is cheaper. I can't find a tm hop up. Also will opening the tm gearbox make the performance worse than the ca. Thanks so much for the replies and help.

[Alex-(BM_5)]

You buy a tm when you want to have a great performing stock gun, if you open the gearbox you have then ruined that. If your gonna replace a lot of JG just get the it and save yourself some money.

[Gimpalong]

I wouldn't buy the TM solely because of the hop-up unit. As mentioned above, you can always get a TM (or other aftermarket) unit and drop it in to replace the CA one.

[aaron96]

I found a metal classic army hop up. The problem is that from what I've seen hop ups are pretty hard to assemble. Also that adds another 40 dollars to the build.

[TheEnd]

There is no "TM magic". Properly assemble any AEG and put a 280 spring in it and you should never have problems. TM is just one of the few companies who puts their shit together decently and put a soft spring in. If you have reliability issues and your shooting less than 450 fps you're doing it wrong.

If putting the hop up together seems difficult to you, are you sure you can handle swapping gears and such? There is a bit of skill to internal upgrades. Properly building a 400 fps gear box is a lot harder than putting a hop up together.

If you don't care about the body and just want a reliable rifle, buy the TM. Just know that you are limited to stock fps unless you swap a few things. The TM will not handle a PDI 170% spring out of the box. You will need metal bushings, probably have swap out the super soft sector gear, a re shim, and a metal spring guide for starters. I don't know if a Marui piston will hold up to 400 fps, should for a while, and you will have an air leak unless you swap to an O ring nozzle. I'm also not sure if the TM V2 has the reinforcement on it. Last I heard TM V2 shells were one of the weakest ones out there, a 170% spring might crack it. They might be reinforcing them now.

Stock fps isn't always a bad thing, but if you are planning to build a long range rifle for outdoors you are going to need more than 260-280 fps. Buying a TM and building it to handle 400 fps is more expensive than buying a CA G3 and doing the basic AOE work, re shim, re lube, and putting a Marui chamber in it.

But with the TM you get the prestige rights I suppose, and some "magic".

[aaron96]

Thanks so much for the reality check. I was basing it on that I have done some gearbox work and not any hop up work. Thank you for the help. I think I will go with the CA.

[Ike]

Apr 9, 2012 15:26:12 GMT -5 TheEnd said:

There is no "TM magic". Properly assemble any AEG and put a 280 spring in it and you should never have problems. TM is just one of the few companies who puts their shit together decently and put a soft spring in. If you have reliability issues and your shooting less than 450 fps you're doing it wrong.

If putting the hop up together seems difficult to you, are you sure you can handle swapping gears and such? There is a bit of skill to internal upgrades. Properly building a 400 fps gear box is a lot harder than putting a hop up together.

If you don't care about the body and just want a reliable rifle, buy the TM. Just know that you are limited to stock fps unless you swap a few things. The TM will not handle a PDI 170% spring out of the box. You will need metal bushings, probably have swap out the super soft sector gear, a re shim, and a metal spring guide for starters. I don't know if a Marui piston will hold up to 400 fps, should for a while, and you will have an air leak unless you swap to an O ring nozzle. I'm also not sure if the TM V2 has the reinforcement on it. Last I heard TM V2 shells were one of the weakest ones out there, a 170% spring might crack it. They might be reinforcing them now.

Stock fps isn't always a bad thing, but if you are planning to build a long range rifle for outdoors you are going to need more than 260-280 fps. Buying a TM and building it to handle 400 fps is more expensive than buying a CA G3 and doing the basic AOE work, re shim, re lube, and putting a Marui chamber in it.

But with the TM you get the prestige rights I suppose, and some "magic".

Everything above.

There may be some issues adding a Marui chamber to the CA. I believe that Tollis was having issues while doing some work on Gunny87's old CA G3 until he swapped out the TM unit for the stock CA unit. Not that it's a big deal, as the Marui unit isn't anything special anyways.

Your parts list sounds decent. The motor won't have any problem with a 170% spring on stock gears, no worries there. I had my G&P M120 motor pulling an M150 spring on the stock gears in my MRP until I switched to a JG blue.

Like TheEnd said, TM gearboxes are known to be weak in the front so you'll want some sorbothane to correct the AOE and protect the gearbox if you do go with TM. The CA box should be fine but you'll want the sorbothane to correct the AOE anyways.