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Post by Flopper (Ozone) on Feb 9, 2012 10:27:49 GMT -5
So I've been researching the new Polar Star HPA system, and I have been considering to buy one of these. I've played around with one and fell in love with it, and they felt extremely solid. But my point of this thread is, that I would like to know if anyone who owns one of these fine pieces of work and has taken it into water and completely submerged it and pulled it out and what the effects have been. I love playing in the water (partly where my callsign "Flopper" comes from) and I've been tied between buying an M4 GBBR or a P* HPA M4. I know that the P* has a small computer chip that controls some functions, but I'm curious to know if anyone knows of ways to work around this and help waterproof it if it's not already. My goal is to completely submerge the rifle under the water for an unknown amount of time, could be like 5 minutes or more, and bring it back up, shake the water off, and immediately fire, I know GBBRs can do this, but they're a bit pricey in the long run. I would like to know what the P* can withstand in terms of water and how well it works after being submerged.
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Post by Dahm on Feb 9, 2012 11:02:55 GMT -5
I don't know if you've ever heard of IP code, but basically it defines the weather-proofness of items. The basics of it is that the rating would be something like IP65. The 6 is the placeholder for solid particle protection like dust, and the 5 is the placeholder for liquid ingress protection. For the liquid ingress, the code is as follows: - 1 - dripping water won't affect it (10 min.)
- 2 - dripping water when tilted at 15 degree's wont affect it (10 min)
- 3 - spraying water (5 min., 0.7 L/min)
- 4 - splashing water (5 min, 10 L/min)
- 5 - water jets of 6.3mm diameter (3 min, 12.5 L/min)
- 6 - powerful 12.5mm jets (3 min, 100 L/min)
- 7 - Immersion up to 1m for 30 minutes
- 8 - Immersion beyond 1m for continuous amount of time
Basically, you can see if the chip has an IP rating somewhere, and then you'll know straight away. However, if you can't find the rating and don't want to find out the hard way, you can try finding a very small IP/NEMA rated enclosure that would fit your specific needs. Unfortunately, liquid ingress of a rating 7 tends to be larger items because the gaskets and hardware get more serious. Either way, I hope this at least helps your search.
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Post by Gimpalong on Feb 9, 2012 11:03:05 GMT -5
Someone on Arnie's (IIRC) mentioned having their P* FCU burnout or die as a result of getting wet. They contacted P* who replaced the unit.
Honestly, I'd avoid taking a dunk with a $600+ gun.
I'm sure, however, that there are ways that you could encase the FCU in something waterproof if you absolutely must take a swim with it.
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Post by cqbr on Feb 9, 2012 11:10:32 GMT -5
PCB varnish.
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Post by Mles on Feb 9, 2012 11:55:23 GMT -5
You know, you could just not go in the water...
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Post by Ike on Feb 9, 2012 12:08:53 GMT -5
You know, you could just not go in the water... There was at least one person at No Limits last weekend who blatantly ignored that rule even though it was posted in the event thread and covered in briefing. I read a good waterproofing tutorial for the FCU and other airsoft electronics a few days ago, I'll see if I can find it.
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Post by X on Feb 9, 2012 12:19:47 GMT -5
You know, you could just not go in the water... There was at least one person at No Limits last weekend who blatantly ignored that rule even though it was posted in the event thread and covered in briefing. I read a good waterproofing tutorial for the FCU and other airsoft electronics a few days ago, I'll see if I can find it. Yeah I remember that. I said "umm I'm pretty sure you can't go in the water" their response was "between the bridges is OK because it's not considered out of bounds on the map" I tried to talk him out of it, but whoever it was was pretty insistent on taking the dive. Thanks for the info Dahm, that's good to know for my day job too.
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Post by snafu on Feb 9, 2012 13:47:45 GMT -5
You know, you could just not go in the water... This^ Why is this so important to you? There is no way I would take a swim with a six hundred dollar gun.
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Post by Flopper (Ozone) on Feb 9, 2012 14:01:32 GMT -5
I don't know if you've ever heard of IP code, but basically it defines the weather-proofness of items. The basics of it is that the rating would be something like IP65. The 6 is the placeholder for solid particle protection like dust, and the 5 is the placeholder for liquid ingress protection. For the liquid ingress, the code is as follows: - 1 - dripping water won't affect it (10 min.)
- 2 - dripping water when tilted at 15 degree's wont affect it (10 min)
- 3 - spraying water (5 min., 0.7 L/min)
- 4 - splashing water (5 min, 10 L/min)
- 5 - water jets of 6.3mm diameter (3 min, 12.5 L/min)
- 6 - powerful 12.5mm jets (3 min, 100 L/min)
- 7 - Immersion up to 1m for 30 minutes
- 8 - Immersion beyond 1m for continuous amount of time
Basically, you can see if the chip has an IP rating somewhere, and then you'll know straight away. However, if you can't find the rating and don't want to find out the hard way, you can try finding a very small IP/NEMA rated enclosure that would fit your specific needs. Unfortunately, liquid ingress of a rating 7 tends to be larger items because the gaskets and hardware get more serious. Either way, I hope this at least helps your search. Thanks for actually helping to an extent. I appreciate the input. I'll look into this as well. Thanks for the other helpers so far as well. As for everyone else who hasn't helped, don't worry about why I want to, or why I would swim with my own stuff. If you're not going to contribute anything don't post. It's that simple.
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Post by Flipper (Traphic) on Feb 9, 2012 14:41:11 GMT -5
1. The area between the bridges is only a foot deep. It's a big puddle.
2. Why get in the water? Water + Airsoft = A better airsoft experience.
3. I just got off the phone with a tech who works for Polar Star. Obviously, because he has to, he said he wouldn't recommend submerging the polar star. He then, for the next 10 minutes, proceeded to tell me ways it could be done. He also mentioned that the new boards coming out in April will have a superior coating on them.
He also went to talk about making a watertight case for it, something I had thought about. He also mentioned some special silicon coating made by GE that you could dip it in and it would be good to go. He told me what could go wrong, most of which I knew, but then he told me ways to get around it.
When I called I wasn't really looking for specifics, I just wanted a general idea if it could be done. I was either expecting a "No way" or a "maybe". Got the maybe.
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Post by Dahm on Feb 9, 2012 15:09:13 GMT -5
Actually I just thought of something else. Coat the entire board in hot glue from a hot glue gun. The glue is non-conductive so it won't ruin your board, and it will be 100% water tight. Problem solved! I used to use hot glue to make sure the contacts from cables I made would not cross over. It works rather well and its a simple cheap solution.
However, do it at your own risk.
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Post by Flopper (Ozone) on Feb 9, 2012 15:14:24 GMT -5
Actually I just thought of something else. Coat the entire board in hot glue from a hot glue gun. The glue is non-conductive so it won't ruin your board, and it will be 100% water tight. Problem solved! I used to use hot glue to make sure the contacts from cables I made would not cross over. It works rather well and its a simple cheap solution. However, do it at your own risk. That sounds actually... Like a grand idea.
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Post by snafu on Feb 9, 2012 16:30:06 GMT -5
What about the barrel and hopup, do you plan to strip out down completely afterwords?
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Post by Flopper (Ozone) on Feb 9, 2012 16:44:59 GMT -5
What about the barrel and hopup, do you plan to strip out down completely afterwords? Yes I do plan to clean my rifle, just as I do after every use anyways, but this thread isn't about that. It's about waterproofing the electronic parts of the P*. Also what the water will do to the P*. So stop skewing this off subject please.
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Post by DasPhoenix on Feb 9, 2012 17:21:52 GMT -5
Actually I just thought of something else. Coat the entire board in hot glue from a hot glue gun. The glue is non-conductive so it won't ruin your board, and it will be 100% water tight. Problem solved! I used to use hot glue to make sure the contacts from cables I made would not cross over. It works rather well and its a simple cheap solution. However, do it at your own risk. The glue is also pretty non conductive from a thermal standpoint. If anything in the P* electronics pulls a good amount of current you could run into some issues with thermal dissipation. That aside, OP is being a prick to anyone who questions his little plan, so I say we just let him dunk a $600 gun and figure it out himself. With luck he'll video tape it.
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