ello
New Member
arivaderchy
Posts: 14
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Post by ello on May 19, 2011 9:47:52 GMT -5
Ok, i am debating weather i should get a LiPo and balancer or just go with the old fashioned Nimh or Nicad. Please tell me what you run (battery wise) and why. Pros and cons appreciated.
-Thanks!
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Post by Knief on May 19, 2011 10:15:17 GMT -5
More importantly, what do you want from your gun? Do you have limited storage space? Are you very concerned with achieving maximum ROF and trigger response? Do you want a battery that's easy to maintain?
A lot of people use a lot of different batteries. The trick is, finding the battery that best suits your needs.
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ello
New Member
arivaderchy
Posts: 14
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Post by ello on May 19, 2011 11:58:15 GMT -5
Storage space is not an issue, ROF is not a big deal to me, trigger response would be nice, and maintenance would not be a big deal ether.
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Post by Knief on May 19, 2011 12:50:29 GMT -5
Sounds to me like a 9.6v NiMh would do you just fine. Lipos are more finicky than NiMh or NiCd batteries, so if you don't need one to fit into a tiny space (peq 15, buffer tube, etc.) or to drive a high ROF gun, there isn't much point to having one over any other battery. Just buy yourself a quality NiMh with the biggest capacity your gun can store and call it a day.
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Post by Fugazi on May 19, 2011 14:22:16 GMT -5
NiCd are my least favorite of the three. They require discharging (which is annoying, and time-consuming) because they "memorize" how much energy is left in them, if any. Then they'll somewhat "automatically" stop charging at that point. It's really odd. They're also large, and the ROF of your gun slows as it dies. There is no upside to these batteries.
NiMh are run-of-the-mill. They are generally the same size as NiCd, but they don't have to be discharged after use. The ROF of your gun also doesn't slow as the battery dies. It starts to poop out right when your battery needs charging, but that's it. These are generally the best battery to stick to if you plan on having your gun last a long time. They're also moderately inexpensive.
LiPos. What I use. They are tiny, and offer superior ROF, and trigger response. Also, they typically charge faster. People often have many negative things to say about LiPos. Most of them are false. They WON'T explode if you charge them with a balance charger, and they WON'T break your gun if you don't abuse them. Other than that, they're just as easy as the other batteries to use. You can't let them die completely however, but that won't happen without a discharger anyway.
Picture your AEG as a vehicle. Your destination is 100,000 miles (or shots) away. The destination is called "whenyourgunbreaks." No matter how fast you go, you're going to get there at 100,000 miles. Now you can go 50mph (16rps) and get there eventually, or you can go 80mph (21rps), and get there much faster. In exchange for saving time, on the timeline, your gun wore out quicker. BUT you got the same amount of rounds out of it, they just come out at a higher rate. Get it?
Hope this helps.
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Post by Knief on May 19, 2011 14:57:27 GMT -5
Usually you know your stuff, fugazi, but your're mistaken on three major points here. First, the memory effect on NiCds is grossly overstated. It only crops up if you continually charge and discharge the battery to the same levels on a regular basis (think solar cycles, charging while the sun is up and using the battery when it's down). When you drain it to different points all the time, memory never really develops. It is healthy to occasionally drain your NiCd fully and gi e it a nice deep charge, but the same is true of all rechargeable batteries.
Second, it's NiCd batteries that have the flat discharge curve. They'll cycle your gun the same all day long right until they drop off a few cycles before they die. NiMh batteries are the ones that slow down throughout the day. That's why SystemA sells NiCd batteries for theor PTWs. The PTW requires a certain amount of juice to even begin to cycle. A NiCd can pro ide that thrpugh its entire life. NiMh batteries, on the other hand, wouldn't have a high enough discharge rate toward the end of its life, so it would stop cycling the gun prematurely.
Lastly, your analogy for 100000 cycles is also wildly incorrect. Using a big battery isn't the same as driving faster. It's a lot more like putting a turbo on your engine. And that will take its toll. Running any mechanical system under higher stress (and higher speed is most definitely higher stress) will wear it out sooner. For the same reason, you shouldn't lay on your trigger in full auto for extended periods of time. It's not just because you're using up a finite number of cycles, it's because the extra strain of sustained full auto increases wear and the chance of failure. Anybody who runs a SAW can tell you how quickly they go through pistons. For that reason, the faster cyclic rate you get from a lipo with a high discharge rate or a 10.8-12V NiMh/NiCd battery comes at a cost. You will end up replacing parts after fewer rounds than you would with a weaker battery.
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Post by Fugazi on May 19, 2011 15:01:57 GMT -5
Ah, I did indeed mistake the NiCd and NiMh at the discharge rate, my mistake. And I thought the memory thing was one of the sad truths to a NiCd, my bad (again). I have however found that without abusing full-auto, the LiPo/car analogy is seemingly true. However your "turbo" analogy is appropriately more correct. Thanks for correcting that, Knief.
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ello
New Member
arivaderchy
Posts: 14
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Post by ello on May 19, 2011 16:29:57 GMT -5
interesting reads from both of you ( i really liked the car comparison ), thank you very much for that. i do say for now that 9.6v NiMh sounds the best bang for my buck. maybe down the road i will switch to LiPo's. Thank you very much you two. SYOTOS!
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Post by Andrew on May 19, 2011 17:51:40 GMT -5
You could always go with a 7.4v lipo.
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Post by Fugazi on May 20, 2011 0:17:36 GMT -5
You could always go with a 7.4v lipo. There's an idea if I've heard one. They're tiny. And I mean tiny. Plus it gives you slightly better ROF and trigger response than an 8.4 (or so I'm told, never owned one). Many people use the stick variation of these in their buffer tubes. |
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Post by Chaos on May 20, 2011 14:52:36 GMT -5
The 7.4 lipo will give you about the same ROF as a 9.6. However, last I checked they don't make a 7.4 stick lipo that fits in the buffer tube.
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Post by Fugazi on May 20, 2011 15:20:13 GMT -5
The 7.4 lipo will give you about the same ROF as a 9.6. However, last I checked they don't make a 7.4 stick lipo that fits in the buffer tube. Troub has one, it uses a 3-cell charger. It's shaped like the KA 11.1, but smaller. |
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mrabedogg
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Thats ma Baybay!
Posts: 4
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Post by mrabedogg on May 31, 2011 17:15:39 GMT -5
i personally like to keep it simple with a 9.6 nimh, good rate of fire, ok trigger response, simple, easy on gears. Lipos are like a person running to the same spot. if they jog there (nimh) they wont be as tired and they can jog back and forth many many times. If they sprint there (LIpo) then they can still go the distance but they will get tired faster and there chance of injury is higher. Nicd.... those are.... well.... complicated and i really don't even mess with them.... hope this helps  |
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Post by Andrew on May 31, 2011 19:33:32 GMT -5
i personally like to keep it simple with a 9.6 nimh, good rate of fire, ok trigger response, simple, easy on gears. Lipos are like a person running to the same spot. if they jog there (nimh) they wont be as tired and they can jog back and forth many many times. If they sprint there (LIpo) then they can still go the distance but they will get tired faster and there chance of injury is higher. Nicd.... those are.... well.... complicated and i really don't even mess with them.... hope this helps Which is why I said to use a 7.4v lipo; all the pros of a lipo, with none of the wear and tear on the gearbox. I assume when you said lipo you meant a 11.1v. I also must add with proper gearbox maintenance even an 11.1v lipo through a gun isn't all that bad. I have had one running to my gun for about 2 months now and can say there are no signs of internal wear; now that is not to say there will not be any problems later on, but I will replace what needs replacing as I need to. But I feel the 11.1v lipos pros far out weight the cons. Others may however disagree, this is why I suggested a 7.4v lipo for someone slightly new to the sport. |
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Post by Tollis on Jun 8, 2011 12:53:09 GMT -5
7.4v Lipos are great to use for guns under 400 FPS, and can make a gun cycle up to 450 FPS. I can run my XM110 on an 7.4v if I had to, and it shoots around the 420 FPS limit. I also use an 11.1 Lipo in my Systema PTW with no problems and I have had it a few years. You just have to watch with lipos so that they don't over discharge and puff out, which is the first stage where they can possibly explode or catch fire.
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