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Post by Bulletproof on Oct 15, 2010 15:58:23 GMT -5
This is probably for future reference for me, but I want to get it off my chest.
I've been looking at vests for a little bit and, I just don't know the ups and downs of all the different carriers and vest-types. I've seen lots of stuff like MOLLE, CIRAS, condor, PANTAC, and cross-draw. Would somebody please recommend a relatively cheap vest/carrier to me. I would like at least 4 rifle mag pouches, radio pouch, perhaps a holster, and I don't know the rest of the essentials.
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Post by Zorak on Oct 15, 2010 16:37:48 GMT -5
The first question is whether or not you can afford to go modular (MOLLE). A modular system will cost more but it will give you the flexibility to move or replace individual pouches later. A non-modular system saves money and may reduce bulk, but can't be customized to reflect changes in your gear or play style.
I never recommend crossdraw rigs. The weak side of your chest is prime real estate and should be used for mags, not a sidearm that you rarely employ.
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Post by Knief on Oct 15, 2010 17:18:53 GMT -5
I think we need to get some nomenclature out of the way first. Condor and Pantac are brands. Pantac is generally regarded as higher end replica stuff. It doesn't quite hold up to the standards of real Eagle or Blackhawk gear, but for the price it's very nice stuff. Condor is cheaper gear that doesn't look quite so nice and probably isn't quite as durable. But at the same time, you're using it for airsoft, your life doesn't depend on it. If it's all you can afford, it's not the worst thing in the world. MOLLE refers to a type pouch attachment system that's pretty standardized. MOLLE gear (both Pantac and Condor make some MOLLE gear, as do most other gear manufacturers) is equipped with 1 inch horizontal strips of nylon or cordura set one inch apart and fastened to the vest in one inch spaces. It sets up a grid of loops. MOLLE pouches attach to the vest using those loops. This gives you the flexibility to move pouches around and set your vest up to match your needs and your comfort. A MOLLE vest is one type of modular vest (modular simply means that the vest layout can be altered easily by the user). CIRAS is a specific type of vest (there are two different models) manufactured by Eagle and copied by a number of other companies. The Pantac version is probably most widely used by airsofters, and the FLYYE is catching up. It's uses the MOLLE system, and thus, is modular. Crossdraw refers to a vest that has a holster mounted on your weak side chest(your left side if you're a righty and your right side if you're a lefty). By definition, a crossdraw vest isn't modular. If it were, it would simply be a tactical vest (or assault vest, depending on who makes it) where the user has placed a holster on the weak side. However, nobody told that to Condor and UTG (another brand). They make a "crossdraw" vest where the holster is set on an angled MOLLE panel, and is removable. Of course, because the loops are angled, you can't really put a whole lot else on there and have it be comfortable. But that's what you get with mediocre gear. Anyway, here are some links: This is a crossdraw: www.blackhawk.com/product/Omega-Vest-Cross-DrawPistol-Mag,16,85.htm This is not a crossdraw, even though a lot of people call it that. It's really just a tactical/assault vest: www.blackhawk.com/product/Omega-Elite-Tactical-Vest-1,14,85.htm This is a modular assault vest: www.blackhawk.com/product/STRIKE-Elite-Vest,753,87.htm The above vests are specifically not [bullet proof] plate carriers. As such, they don't see a lot of use in today's US Military because they don't offer that layer of protection that a plate carrier has. If you buy one, you're going to look a bit outdated. That's not a bad thing if you're going for a specific impression or you just prefer the assault vest style. That's up to you. Crossdraws are usually a bad idea for the reasons Zorak cited. This is a MOLLE vest: www.rstacticalgear.com/pd_molle_style_rhodesian.cfmThere are many different styles of MOLLE vests. The vest I linked to above this one is also a MOLLE vest. The MOLLE loops are quite clear in this picture, though, so I thought it would make a good example. This particular vest is a Rhodesian Recon Vest (commonly abbreviated RRV). It is a plate carrier in that you can put a ceramic plate in the front. There is an available back panel that allows you to put a plate in the back, too. This is a CIRAS: www.wiskurtactical.com/product.php?productid=16212CIRAS stands for Combat Integrated Releasable Armor System. Note on the left that no pockets are attached, you see the bare loops. The vest shown to the right is configured with a set of pouches in a way that the user might set them up using the MOLLE loops. But you can arrange them pretty much however you want, as long as everything you want will fit on the vest. The CIRAS is popular in large part because it has a lot of space for pouches. The MOLLE vest that I linked to above this has a lot less space, so you can't attach as many pouches, and thus can't carry quite as much stuff. The CIRAS, like the RRV is a plate carrier. Those are the basics. If you get a modular vest, some come with pouches included in the package, others do not. Be aware of whether or not you're getting pouches and what those pouches are. A non-modular vest will obviously include pouches, so make sure you like the layout of those pouches because you can't change them. With this information, go back out and do a little more searching. If you've still got some questions, come on back and ask. |
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Post by Bulletproof on Oct 15, 2010 18:38:00 GMT -5
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Post by arguablycrassic on Oct 15, 2010 20:32:56 GMT -5
I was just going to point out that you have 1 set of AR pouches that have pistol mags on top of them, and then another set of AR pouches. I don't know if you meant this or if you were unaware.
BTW, for magazine pouches, I personally like open tops, just because I hate dealing with a flap that gets in the way.
And for a dump pouch, I would recommend mounting it to your belt instead of your vest, it can be a real pain in the ass having a bag full of plastic smacking against you. Not necessarily painful, just distracting.
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Post by Bulletproof on Oct 15, 2010 21:02:41 GMT -5
I was just going to point out that you have 1 set of AR pouches that have pistol mags on top of them, and then another set of AR pouches. I don't know if you meant this or if you were unaware. BTW, for magazine pouches, I personally like open tops, just because I hate dealing with a flap that gets in the way. And for a dump pouch, I would recommend mounting it to your belt instead of your vest, it can be a real pain in the ass having a bag full of plastic smacking against you. Not necessarily painful, just distracting. I know about the extra AR mag pouches, thanks for the open top advice. And about mounting the dump pouch on your belt, does that mean that I would have to buy the MOLLE belt(http://www.airsoftpost.com/product_info.php?products_id=29485) to mount the dump pouch on my belt? And here is |
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Post by arguablycrassic on Oct 15, 2010 22:21:57 GMT -5
In the best case scenario, yes, but you can mount it to any plain belt, it'll just be a little looser than say a molle cummerbund or such.
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h5n1
New Member
Posts: 12
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Post by h5n1 on Oct 16, 2010 1:19:41 GMT -5
I have the condor crossdraw and for about $50 it does everything i need it to. It has 3 m4 mag pouches (says they each can hold 2 mags but i cant confirm) a pistol holster with molle under it, some extra pistol mag sized pouches and molle on the back.
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Post by Great Troub of Troubistan on Oct 16, 2010 23:40:26 GMT -5
If you read previous threads on this subject you'd know that the first thing we suggest is "DO NOT GET CAMOUFLAGE GEAR!"
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Post by Bulletproof on Oct 17, 2010 11:48:56 GMT -5
If you read previous threads on this subject you'd know that the first thing we suggest is "DO NOT GET CAMOUFLAGE GEAR!" Your right, I didn't read that. Thanks Troubadour. |
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Post by a1 (Babez) on Oct 17, 2010 13:42:17 GMT -5
the first thing we suggest is "DO NOT GET CAMOUFLAGE GEAR!" Well, IMO, ACU should be the only exception. But, yes, I do agree with troub. |
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Post by Chaffin on Oct 17, 2010 13:54:01 GMT -5
^ this or multicam. But that can be gotten around with a tan vest. But as knife explains below, it only works if you have the camo to match it.
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Post by Knief on Oct 17, 2010 14:02:31 GMT -5
No pattern is an exception. An ACU vest on top of US Woodland looks just as stupid as a Multicam Vest on top of an OD flight suit. The exception comes when you have more than one rig. If you've already got a generic tan or green set up, and then want to get a vest to match your camo, go for it. But when all you own is a camo vest, you're going to look like a noob when you put that with any BDUs that don't match. Eventually, you'll get a second set of camo. If you have a vest in a pattern that matches your first set of camo, it will look bad with your second set. But if you have a tan or OD vest, it will probably go just fine with either set. In the first case, you've got to buy a second vest. In the second case, you can use one vest with both camos. Occasionally, there are times when a patterned vest can work well with a mis-matched camo. If you're doing a specific impression that dictates it, then go for it. The best example is the woodland IBA or OD LC-2 gear on top of desert camo, a la US Army in the Gulf War: www.kevinmd.com/blog/uploaded_images/061110_gulfwar_hmed1p.hmedium-773380.jpgBut, since this advice is pretty much only going to be relevant to new players, you can probably take impressions out of the picture, as most new players just want something functional and good looking. |
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Post by Bulletproof on Oct 17, 2010 20:37:30 GMT -5
No pattern is an exception. An ACU vest on top of US Woodland looks just as stupid as a Multicam Vest on top of an OD flight suit. The exception comes when you have more than one rig. If you've already got a generic tan or green set up, and then want to get a vest to match your camo, go for it. But when all you own is a camo vest, you're going to look like a noob when you put that with any BDUs that don't match. Eventually, you'll get a second set of camo. If you have a vest in a pattern that matches your first set of camo, it will look bad with your second set. But if you have a tan or OD vest, it will probably go just fine with either set. In the first case, you've got to buy a second vest. In the second case, you can use one vest with both camos. Occasionally, there are times when a patterned vest can work well with a mis-matched camo. If you're doing a specific impression that dictates it, then go for it. The best example is the woodland IBA or OD LC-2 gear on top of desert camo, a la US Army in the Gulf War: www.kevinmd.com/blog/uploaded_images/061110_gulfwar_hmed1p.hmedium-773380.jpgBut, since this advice is pretty much only going to be relevant to new players, you can probably take impressions out of the picture, as most new players just want something functional and good looking. I have reviewed your post several times, and do not yet fully understand it, but I have put together that you are suggesting I get a OD or tan vest to go with most available camos. However, how would a black vest work? It wouldn't blend well with, well, anything. But it's black and gives you that "tactical" feeling. I think for me it would be a choice between OD and black, and unless you strongly appose black, I believe that would be my choice. |
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Post by Phantom G3 on Oct 17, 2010 22:26:11 GMT -5
I believe you said you wanted to turn your SIG 550 into a sniper rifle, correct? If you wear black, that will stand way out and contradict the point of sniping. Not all snipers want to wear a ghillie suit, but black just isn't the best for blending in any wooded areas.
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