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Post by ~Ranger~ on Oct 20, 2014 10:43:39 GMT -5
Hey guys, just need to ask for ideas why the Maple leaf bucking gave me 100ft less range, and killed my accuracy.
Before anyone says something funny like "did you install it correctly?"
Yeah, I for sure know how to install a bucking haha..
I bought a Maple leaf bucking and Maple leaf concave nub recently, installed it and WOW.. Now I have about 70ft range, with about a 5-10 ft spread. With my hopup turned all the way off, it is still on too much and bb's just go everywhere, except where I aim. I took out the ML nub cause its just too tall and may have to mod it some. I used a standard nub and got better results "results posted above are with standard nub"..
Its a 60 degree, and some friends said that must be the issue. My G36 only shoots 350fps so I dont see it being an fps issue really. I have always used soft buckings, no matter the fps cause I feel soft gives better grip over hard buckings. Yes, I may have to replace them more often, but I accept that and choose the better performance over durability.
The mound inside the ML bucking just sticks down sooooo far inside my inner barrel that I think its blocking the bb's making them come out unstable creating terrible performance.
Should I just get out the little file and sand the mound and treat it like an R hop? Throw it away? Or just try it in my sons M4 cause maybe its just because of the style of the G36 hopup?
I can sand down the nub as well, and make it fit something else if need be.
If anyone has any input for this, please chime in cause I am curious what others have had to do.
Thank you.
Edit... I also think the g36 wheel style adjuster puts more pressure on one side than the other. Thinking a type of tdc mod, in my head it seems possible.
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Gabriel
New Member
The face of a man who has seen the Ancient Ones is forever twisted by the memory.
Posts: 455
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Post by Gabriel on Oct 20, 2014 11:00:03 GMT -5
Buckings have break in time. You should put a few thousand rounds through it before you declare it bad.
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Post by Puma1 on Oct 20, 2014 11:07:45 GMT -5
G36 hop ups are the main reason I switched back to any other gun on the market. I tried mad bull, Prommy, Maple leaf, G&G green and angel customs hop up buckings before I found a combo that worked nicely. The problem is that the area for the nub is so small it is nearly impossible to get a flat hop or anything like that going. Being about half the size of an M4 opening, and after trying both Lonex and 2 different JG hop up systems, I sold it and went back to the m4. As far as consistency and range of hop: Here's what worked for me. Prommy straight bucking (No mound) with an H-nub. ( www.evike.com/products/37761 ) G&G green with h-nub. (Required sanding the internal bucking nub down) This and the above were the best - Prommy combo yielded better accuracy, G&G slightly more range, a little less accuracy past ~ 130ft. Madbull with standard nub Maple leaf, standard rubber nub. Angel customs + anything else. I'd personally grab a prommy blue and the h-nubs linked above. While the maple leaf is nice, it really only works well with a very soft nub in g36's. Hope this helps.
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Post by ~Ranger~ on Oct 20, 2014 13:34:37 GMT -5
I went through about 4,000 rounds hoping that would break it in, never helped. I used my drum mag.
Currently I use the g&g green and its alright, but yeah.. accuracy isnt what I hoped for. I was considering sanding out a mound, and using the maple leaf concave nub. This would in theory give good contact, and not block the bb.
I dont need pinpoint accuracy per say, cause I am using an Mg36 but it would be nice to get better accuracy. Right now everything is stock, and am debating on a 6.05, nothing tighter.
Thanks for the replies guys..
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Post by Puma1 on Oct 20, 2014 13:42:57 GMT -5
If it's feasible, I'd strongly consider an r-hop. Even one done well instead of perfect will still fling BB's for a ways.
I'd imagine the sanded G&G with the concave nub should be a pretty good combo. I have no experience with the ML nub, so please let me know how it turns out if that's what you do.
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Post by ~Ranger~ on Oct 20, 2014 13:59:29 GMT -5
Will do buddy. Been thinking of a few little things I could do to make the hopup engage evenly. Maybe shave the nub on one side to match the wheel adjusters shape.
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Post by Squirrel on Oct 20, 2014 14:07:10 GMT -5
The Maple Leaf bucking can give really good results. The problem is there are several bad batches of Maple Leaf buckings out there. Some of them have deformed or poorly placed mounds due to a molding error. Others have too much material thickness in the shoulders of the lip of the bucking.
I have had a bad one, and I have two very good ones.
The issue with the buckings was discovered by some of the users in the Wolverine SMP Owners group on facebook by one of the users (either works for AMPED or Bingo).
It is a shame that there is a bunch of bad ones out there, because the two 70* ones that I have work almost as good as a properly installed R-Hop.
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Post by Puma1 on Oct 20, 2014 14:12:39 GMT -5
I semi agree with your statement of the wheel creating uneven pressure. I've heard of people sanding down the actual adjuster to make it more even. I'm very skeptical that will actually work though, because the difference is so minscule. In my mind, it makes more sense to sand a straight portion into the adjuster wheel, which also locks your hop up in place.
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Post by ~Ranger~ on Oct 20, 2014 14:23:57 GMT -5
I actually heard about a bad batch being out there, that sucks..
As for the adjuster mod, I considered messing with the wheel, but that would be an ongoing issue if done wrong, but re shaping a nub to match is cheaper and maybe easier. Thought about maybe shaping the hopup arm as well. Having flat spots on the wheel isnt a bad idea, though.. would just need to keep it adjustable without hanging up on little notches so the ends of the flat spots would need to be rounded. Nice!!
You have my gears grinding now haha..
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Post by Puma1 on Oct 20, 2014 14:26:41 GMT -5
I actually heard about a bad batch being out there, that sucks.. As for the adjuster mod, I considered messing with the wheel, but that would be an ongoing issue if done wrong, but re shaping a nub to match is cheaper and maybe easier. Thought about maybe shaping the hopup arm as well. Having flat spots on the wheel isnt a bad idea, though.. would just need to keep it adjustable without hanging up on little notches so the ends of the flat spots would need to be rounded. Nice!! You have my gears grinding now haha.. Pun intended, I imagine.
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Post by pxranger on Oct 20, 2014 14:28:35 GMT -5
I've been experimenting with different hops in my MK12.
Two buckings that sucked out of the box were the PDI "W" Hold, and a Maple Leaf 75*. These two buckings wouldn't even feed a BB, as in the lip was too big; BB's just rolled right on through.
I've got an ORGA Magnus 6.23 in my MK12 and I'm still experimenting. Before the Orga, I had a Systema 6.04, combined with a Madbull 60* and a E-1 concave nub, and had decent results. But switching to the wide bore gave me unexpected results. But, could also be due to the loss in fps. I haven't chronoed with .20's yet to see where she's at, as she was at just under 360fps for the Airhouse in K-Zoo.
Trying to find a "normal" hop set-up before attempting to rhop. Rhop is such a pain in the ass to perfect. I bought a rhopped ZCI 6.02 directly from HunterSeeker, but I can't seem to get the grime out that accumulated in the inner barrel, and the barrel has a terrible right hook. But the 6.02 can sling a BB well past 200ft with ease.
This ORGA barrel "seems" to be pretty accurate, but it's being fickle over what hop system to use. I'm trying to avoid installing an rhop at this time.
Returning to the subject matter; I had heard nothing but good things about the Maple Leaf buckings, so it was a bitter disappointment to have the one I purchased not feed any rounds.
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Post by ~Ranger~ on Oct 20, 2014 15:06:34 GMT -5
Yeah, I tried the R hop thing and its a serious headache. I grew tired of trying to perfect it and just gave up.
Tried a Reaps, and it was a bust as well. I think I will give up on specialty buckings, never had issues with standard buckings, and always got good kills.
I was wondering about the widebore barrels but logically it makes no sense cause the air escape would be horrific. Maybe I just expect too much from an aeg since I am so used to long range bolt rifles.
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Post by Squirrel on Oct 20, 2014 15:39:02 GMT -5
A widebore would be tough to get enough air volume through even with a bore-up cylinder. I know the Wolverine SMP has trouble with wide bore as they don't have the volume available. Polarstar guns can take advantage of them due to their more adjustable FCU and higher volume nozzles.
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Post by ~Ranger~ on Oct 20, 2014 15:43:57 GMT -5
That makes more sense actually. I like 6.05's, not too tight, not too loose.
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Post by pxranger on Oct 20, 2014 15:46:17 GMT -5
With a widebore, you do have a loss in fps. The ideal is to up the main power spring when getting these barrels. I just have yet to do it, haha.
There is in Quantum Physics, a little something called quantum confinement. Think of the old Atari game, "Pong". The closer the paddles got together, the faster and more the dot bounced back and forth between the paddles. In this case, paddles equals the sides of the inner barrel, and the bouncing of the dot equals the BB bouncing its way down the inner barrel. Granted it's just theory based off of HunterSeeker's explanation of rhop.
Right now I have a G&G green bucking with a flat nub from the Modify Ryusoku flat hop. "Seems" okay, but the lack of fps is not giving enough cushion of air to effectively push the BB down barrel, in my opinion. Back to Quantum confinement *cough*
If mastered, an rhop with the 6.23 would be sick.
*edit I had rhopped my TM VSR-10's PDI 6.08 and it was pretty damned accurate. More so than any of my other rifles which were rhopped at that time. Was shooting around 495-500fps range w/.20's. But I decided to give a try at ERHop, and it didn't go well. Ruined an $80 inner barrel. Now I'm recuperating from all the money I've been spending on this shit. haha
I've also given up on rhop due to the tediousness of installing it.
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