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Post by kaboose1 on Oct 17, 2010 18:39:14 GMT -5
Canto, thanks for a great time like always!!! I hope you are still alive and not in Ma's refrigerator to be served as the Chinese food special. Anyways, I was the tan CO and I must really upset about the second half. I had my Coms up, but no one ever responded to any of my orders. When I started to get a few guys to tell them about the objectives, they chose to say "f-it" and that they weren't going to to the objectives. So I tried my best and getting some things done but with the "Chinese" in play we were out numbered like 10 - 3. I saw cheating a few times and had to pull my Mod powers once. Otherwise I had a blast like always. A bad day of airsofting is still a better day than when I don't airsoft. Dingo, and the rest of black talon, you guys are the best! Andre, great getting to see you and your team again; Tex, I wish I was able to play with you, but it was still really great to see you.
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Post by Canto on Oct 17, 2010 20:47:11 GMT -5
First and foremost, I would like to thank all of the MiA members and members of surrounding airsoft communities for attending our annual airsoft event. Without you, we couldn't keep doing it. This is the last event in the Operation: Flash Fire series, however the story isn't done yet. There will be another event in October of 2011 as well. As for the Charlotte field. I'm sure that most of you know that we operate events out of Bangor from May through October. Charlotte runs events November through April. Using the Charlotte field for an airsoft event during the spring/summer/fall months will not work for us. We would be isolated to a single field and rotated around or restricted to different ones based on paintball traffic. Trenches, Village, Woodsball Field. Those are three separate fields that we combine into one field, due to the fact that Chaos Paintball is closed for the season and we operate here during their off months. Again, thank you for all the support that everyone always shows us. We really appreciate it! Now, onto the gritty part that I personally don't like... Reading reviews like these, make me not want to continue running airsoft events. The event coordinators themselves can only control very few factors that contribute to a event. The players themselves are the ones to make the real decisions. I prefer to think of Bangor as one of MiA's more liberal fields. We tolerate an extreme amount of horseplay, general tomfoolery, and a very enjoyable time... These are traits that we want Bangor and all the other fields we work with to have as well. Unfortunately, at the current rate we are going. We're going to need to crack down on everything... A handful of points I have read and observed. - Goggles. No issues at all this event! Way to go Michigan Airsoft! - Lewd Graffiti. I was not aware of this until it had already happened... I know who was responsible for this as well... Seriously guys!? This is a public airsoft/paintball field, why would you tag a building with that? Highly disrespectful to me, my team, and Hole In The Wall. - Cheating. I heard only a handful of complaints the entire day about cheating. Please bring these to the attention of a ref/moderator. If we do not know about it, or you tell us it's already been resolved; what can we do? - Players Randomly Leaving The Event. I suppose my question is... You paid to be here, why leave early? This not only threw the entire 2nd half of the game down the drain, I counted four (4) tan team players at 5:30 PM on the field. Four people... - Players Without Communications Equipment. We cannot control who comes with and who comes without communications equipment. - Lack of Objectives and Motivation.1) Motivation - We cannot control this... 2) Lack of Objectives - This event, going on tips given to us by Talisman back in May, came up with a system of issuing both commanders objective lists, of which they could pick and choose what they were going after. At all times, there was a minimum of 2 (two) and maximum of 4 (four) objectives in play during the entire event. I understand there was a mass communications equipment failure at this event, which may have influenced whether or not players knew of their objectives. But however, they were issued at the appropriate times and were in play during the entire event. I feel as whole that this event was yet another resounding disappointment for me personally. Making massive changes to existing event systems based on participant input isn't working... We make the changes that people ask for, yet the players themselves cause the breakdown. It's discouraging and counter-productive. I'm not singling out anyone in particular, but I hope people can see where we are coming from here...
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Post by kaboose1 on Oct 17, 2010 20:56:27 GMT -5
Canto, personally I think that the objective list was perfect! I like having only a few objectives that were very straightforward was great compared to where everyone gets objectives and runs a muck. The objectives you gave us were obviously challenging and you gave out plenty, trust me.
The lack of motivation and the fact that the tans left wasn't directed at you Canto, believe me. I was addressing the tans. Its not your fault if they leave or aren't motivated. If they can't have fun being there then they shouldn't have come.
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Post by Ghast on Oct 17, 2010 20:58:04 GMT -5
Awww john. Don't be like that I had a fucking blast Got the most kills today than any other day of playing in my entire career.
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Post by Canto on Oct 17, 2010 21:03:28 GMT -5
Greg,
I understand man, it's just discouraging as hell. I personally I thought the objective system worked extremely well. It not only took pressure off of the event staff, but provided clarification on what needed to be done without causing large volumes of radio chatter.
Max,
I know man. I'm not trying to be like that.
The way to look at it is, we control only 50% of the event, the players themselves decide the other 50%.
We're all out here to have fun, be with our friends, and our community. I wish it would work as well as it seems typed out here...
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Post by mobbro on Oct 17, 2010 21:13:52 GMT -5
To those who don't know who I am, I was the volunteer CO of the Green team at the event and here is my review... I drove from Addison, IL for 2 hours to Bangor for this event in the hopes of getting my hands dirty and getting at least a dozen kills like I always have when I get out there at these events. I was loaded up and ready to do some damage, but then I find out there is no CO for the Green team and nobody was volunteering for the job, so I decided I would volunteer because I had a little experience in being a CO for events. Now I was a bit bummed out about that because I think the CO's for the events should be figured out BEFORE the event actually starts, but that's all I'm really pointing out. As for the event itself: I'm reading a lot about the negative reviews about this past event so I am going to try and "resolve" a few of them if I can. "The field is to hard to play in"- Would you like to have nice paved paths with little benches on the side to sit down and rest whenever there isn't something going on? No, it isn't SUPPOSE to be an easy field to be in! It is EXACTLY like like Canto said in the beginning of EVERY event at the Bangor field "This is a tough terrain, no bullshit" The "game" of airsoft is meant to simulate a real war zone, and I think the Bangor field does exactly that. You literally have to crawl up the hill to get back to your spawn, CRAWL! Can't can't more tough then that. "I never once made it to the southern side of the field; closest I got was about halfway down the north ridge near Village A."- Being the CO of the Green team, I did everything in my power to make SURE that didn't happen. How? I made sure reinforcements were ALWAYS ready to support the guys who have died, the tactical positions were always well covered and hidden, and most of all, my men moved quickly so we were able to take villages and objectives at a much faster pace than the TAN team. "I didn't know my objective, so I didn't know what to do"- I do put a bit of blame on the CO's for this one. I myself tried as hard as I can to make sure everyone on my team knew what they were doing, I always had guys come up asking me what objective we needed to do, and I always cleared them right up. I see that it wasn't the same for the TAN side. I'm not sure about the TAN side and the miscommunication between it's player's, but all I know is that the CO takes a big responsibility in that aspect. Doesn't ALWAYS have to be the CO that takes charge. If you don't know where your CO is, take charge with a squad and go after something. If you HAD a radio, which EVERYONE should ALWAYS have, then radio in the MOD tower and ask what is up, I'm sure they would have cleared some things up. "Trash talking"- I understand that some might be offended about what others say to them, but like I said in the previous comments above, this is suppose to reenact or simulate a war zone. Of course there is going to be trash talking between the enemy teams. In what professional sport is there not some form of trash talking. If you are really to offended by what is going on in these " simulated event" then don't play the sport in the first place. "Not calling hits"- Of course there is going to be people not calling hits. Armory Airsoft players are made up of a very respectable group of people, honest people. But then there are the beginners who think that if no one saw anything, I won't have to walk up that big hill to my respawn. Yes I get frustrated also, but that is how it is. There are so many reasons why hits weren't being called. 1) Someone has a little to much gear on, and can't feel a 6mm BB hit his backpack (aim for the face ;D), 2) Your BB's just aren't getting through those thick bushes, or even across to that ridge, even if it may appear so. The slightest change in wind or twig can change the BB's path, 3) They are LITERALLY not calling hits, but Armory Airsoft and the Mods do everything they can to make sure that it doesn't happen. Got to give them some slack. All in all, I enjoy FlashFire V. It WAS worth the drive, it really was. Always awesome to see old friends who punch you in the balls to make sure you won't reproduce children in the future, and to just do what I love to do....airsoft, real airsoft. Thanks to EVERYONE on the GREEN team for helping us get a great victory. Even though the TAN team feels like it was unfair, remember, from the start, it is all equal. Just depends on how you play from there and out. There were so many times you could have pushed through and gotten through, but because of lack of communication and leadership, it didn't happen. But it WAS a great challenge. There were so many great players on both sides. P.S. Piper and Team Immortal, one of the greatest group of guys I have ever played with. Anyone on the GREEN team that wants to add me on facebook to keep in touch. My link is below. See ya, -David Rohlf (CO of Green Team) www.facebook.com/home.php#!/profile.php?id=1037951578
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Post by mobbro on Oct 17, 2010 21:37:48 GMT -5
By the way....Skycop? Pictures? NOW!!! Thank you that is all.
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Post by Grimm(3.14) on Oct 17, 2010 23:19:35 GMT -5
I have to say that, being the first time on the field..........WOW is all I have to say. That field is by far the most intense field I have been on.
Awesome job to Canto and the others for hosting a fun event. I had a blast, and thought the objectives were fun and the way you gave them to each side was a very good idea.
As I was one of the people who left early, reason for that is I re-agrivated my ankle coming down the ridges when the first half ended, otherwise I would have been there the whole time.
It takes a lot of moving, hiding, and sneaking around just to get to a reasonable spot to "snipe" or "hide" with knowing that both ridges can see you if your not careful. I know I was spotted several times by tan troops in the village while trying to sneak in close to get a good sniping spot. So with that, my hats off to the tan team on keeping your flanks covered. Especially the troops that were in the village.
Now as I saw from a few people on the tan's sides responses above, yes there was a few shots that I saw that were not called, and I'll be honest a majority of us green that saw the few that were not calling the shots made sure that they knew they were hit. Hell, myself and one of my fellow Immortal team mates were told that we got hit by fellow troops just for the fact that we didn't feel it or heard it. As the few statements above said, it's an honor system. BE HONEST IF YOU GET HIT, BUT WE CAN NEVER HAVE AN EVENT WHERE IT'S PERFECT.
Great job to mobbro (David Rohlf) for being the CO of the green team. You did one hell of a job keeping us updated on mission objectives, and having us keep the reinforcements in the right areas. I'd gladly run with you again, and follow orders.
Again, thanks for the great game Canto and I hope to be out there next year when you host the next one. Take care,
Grimm
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necro
New Member
Light em' up!
Posts: 4
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Post by necro on Oct 17, 2010 23:49:22 GMT -5
I would have gladly taken my coms into the field, however I was going with out a chest rig and had nowhere to secure the radio to my person. Not a mistake I will make in the future.
We walked off the field right around 5:20, partly due to the fact that we were both completely out of ammo, partly due to the fact that what was left of Tan was a dozen or so scattered men. Yes, the fact that we had paid to play crossed my mind, but at that point it was less of a sticking point than the others.
As far as Trash Talking is concerned, there is no reason to be screaming out "Mother F---er" and "F--- you!" when there are kids running around the field with you. And you should never come off like you are trying to start a fistfight, with your teammates holding you back from actually doing so. I understand your point as far a RP is concerned, but at a certain point that sort of asshattery isn't adding anything to the game.
Kudos to Green team for beating us. I have no qualms with anything that any member of Green did. Didn't see/hear anything bad about your guys. The DPRK members that carpooled with us had only good things to say about your leadership and organization.
Canto, I know you and others went through a lot of work to put this event on, and I am glad that I went. At the very least, I learned a lot about some players on Tan that I previously had not played with, and previously had respect for. I am looking forward to playing at Charlotte, already heard good things about the field, and I am sure that you are going to put on a good event.
Don't be surprised if I am wearing a green camo, though.
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Post by mobbro on Oct 18, 2010 0:11:49 GMT -5
I would have gladly taken my coms into the field, however I was going with out a chest rig and had nowhere to secure the radio to my person. Not a mistake I will make in the future. We walked off the field right around 5:20, partly due to the fact that we were both completely out of ammo, partly due to the fact that what was left of Tan was a dozen or so scattered men. Yes, the fact that we had paid to play crossed my mind, but at that point it was less of a sticking point than the others. As far as Trash Talking is concerned, there is no reason to be screaming out "Mother F---er" and "F--- you!" when there are kids running around the field with you. And you should never come off like you are trying to start a fistfight, with your teammates holding you back from actually doing so. I understand your point as far a RP is concerned, but at a certain point that sort of asshattery isn't adding anything to the game. Kudos to Green team for beating us. I have no qualms with anything that any member of Green did. Didn't see/hear anything bad about your guys. The DPRK members that carpooled with us had only good things to say about your leadership and organization. Canto, I know you and others went through a lot of work to put this event on, and I am glad that I went. At the very least, I learned a lot about some players on Tan that I previously had not played with, and previously had respect for. I am looking forward to playing at Charlotte, already heard good things about the field, and I am sure that you are going to put on a good event. Don't be surprised if I am wearing a green camo, though. Necro, I apologize if my review post looked like it was just directed toward you. There were a few of guys who have made the same remarks so just wanted to clear it up. First things first. I in NO way agree or condone what those players who wanted to literally fist fight someone did during the event. I believe that the MODS should be told about what had happened and they would have taken care of it. I do agree that is WAY to far to go into. As for the swearing around kids, understandable, but like Canto said, not in their control. Don't base your opinion on AA's events at this field or their events in general just solely on FFV. There were a handful of guys to ruin and break the rules. Canto and the AA staff by far are the best airsoft event runners in all of the Midwest and I hope someday in the future it will be nationwide. And to everyone giving me good compliments about my leadership on the GREEN team I thank you. Means a lot. I did enjoy taking the challenge that was given to me....that day.haha.
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Post by rooster on Oct 18, 2010 9:11:35 GMT -5
I had a great time. Canto and AA put on yet another great OP. I like having the multiple missions to choose from at any given time. I had a great time spotting for one of the snipers with Immortals, as quick as I could point them out- he would put them down. I didn't have any problems with people not calling hits and only got over killed once. It seems to me that those that where on the green team loved the game, those on the tan team hated it. Most of the first half of the game was a stale mate. Both cities where heavily defended from the high ground which made it impossible to take and hold either of them. As soon as one team would move into a city, they would have a huge barrage of incoming BBs followed by troops pouring in out of the hills. I have seen several post that say there was no action in the first half, but I watched green and tan teams trade cities A and C back and forth several times during the first half. I had a blast during the first half. To me the second half was the let down, and that is because TAN TEAM LEFT. I can't thank Canto and AA enough for putting this together I had a blast.
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MaddHatta
New Member
Saginaw Valley State
Posts: 43
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Post by MaddHatta on Oct 18, 2010 11:26:12 GMT -5
Well first and foremost, I'd like to thank everyone who came together and made the event possible. Canto, who I had never met before the event and the guys from FAH who I have played with before; I thank you guys for making the day fun. My buddy Necro and I along with our friend Dutch and my little brother drove three hours to get to Bangor. So we were stoked. Personally, I found the field not as rough as I had expected. Playing a few times at Young's and constantly walking up and down the "bitch" as it's called definitely prepares you for rough woodland terrain. However, I liked the layout of the field. The two teams trying to hold their ridges and really just throw rounds at each other made it feel like a genuine combat situation. Any time, any place, you could get knocked out. I liked that aspect. I liked how the CO's handed down the orders, despite the lack of coms on Necro or myself, things seemed organized for the most part at the beginning of the game. While I didn't know the objectives first-hand, I knew where I had to be and where I had to fire. Towards the end, a few FAH guys and myself did the best we could to keep Green out of Alpha without really any information from command. We just did what we do best, shoot people. Overall, I had fun. The second game was a bit disappointing and I did end up leaving the field early due to the fact I was out of ammo like Necro said, and my battery was dying. I had a few issues with hit calling over by Alpha and I'll admit, it made me a bit frustrated. I did NOT appreciate the "threats" by some tan guys on our side screamed down to green members. I thought it was childish and pathetic, but oh well. Some guys have short fuses. Thanks again, guys. Green team, you did great. Most games I've been to, Green has been fodder thrown into a meat grinder but you guys were legit. It was fun playing on the Tan team, despite a few minor issues and I met some really great guys; especially when I was back at the respawn area because I took a BB to the face or something.
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Post by Flying Dutchman on Oct 18, 2010 11:47:40 GMT -5
Let me say this first, when an airsoft game keeps you engaged and interested for literally the entire time, even if there aren't always enemies to kill right in front of you, that's a damn good game. I think what made the immersion possible was the fact that I had a radio and a few of my confused teammates didn't. I had kids running up to me asking what the objectives were and asking me to radio things in to the CO, which I didn't do because our CO was literally busy the entire time with much more important things. (A kid wanted me to radio in that there were tangos on the ridge and in city D while we were in City C, and he told me that I have to radio in to the commander to ask what to do, which I promptly denied.) I would definitely suggest to any and all participants in any of these macro games or any games where the field is larger than 5 acres to use a radio or at least get into a squad where at least someone has one.
I personally did not have any problems with the field, the other team, or the CO's. In fact, our (green) CO made the game that much better. I've had some pretty shitty COs in the past and it can ruin a game when the enemy is far more organized and coherent. I am so thankful that that wasn't at all the case for Green team this time. For that, I want to thank you mobbro.
All in all, great place, just wish it was 3-4 hours closer! And next time I'll actually bring my battery for my gun. :-D -Dutchman
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KiloMike
New Member
Like Grandpa always says "Don't do that." Don't be the person he says that to.
Posts: 494
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Post by KiloMike on Oct 18, 2010 12:44:20 GMT -5
By the way....Skycop? Pictures? NOW!!! Thank you that is all. Demanding much! Dang but yeah pics please.
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Post by Gimpalong on Oct 18, 2010 14:12:11 GMT -5
I had a decent time at Flashfire V. It definitely had its fair share of dull moments, but also a good deal of action. I enjoyed plinking down on the village with another player's M14 DMR.
I had a long conversation with a couple of players who had never been on the field before and even they could see the potential for unbreakable stalemates.
I've heard that this has been tried before, but would it not be possible to have one team's start location/deadzone near the field entrance and the other team's start location at Alpha (far end of the field near the marshy area, way opposite of the airfield)? That way both the northern and southern ridges could be utilized by both teams instead of each being essentially the sole property of one team.
At some point, the owner might want to have a field build day and invite players to help set up some new bunkers, trenches, etc. The field has a lot of dead space that makes approaching certain areas very difficult. For example, it is difficult to effectively assault from alpha up through the northern or southern ridges. The result is that one team usually holds alpha, while the other team holds the high ground on one side or the other. Erecting some new buildings on either side of alpha and even having bunkers built into the hill side would be useful in allowing teams to move about without stalemate.
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