Tightbore barrel help?

[Nate!!!!]

I'm looking to get a 6.01 tightbore barrel that will fit my Well MB07. It has a 515mm stock barrel right now. I heard that it is compatible with Vsr-10 upgrades but I can't find a vsr-10 barrel that is longer or even close to 515mm. Help would be greatly appreciated!

[fuzzywolly]

I do not recommend anything tighter than a 6.03mm barrel. Your accuracy will actually suffer from longer distances with the 6.01mm barrel. Get a 6.03 and you will be much happier.

Sorry, but I cannot help you with the finding of the compatible barrel, just wanted to let you know that a 6.03 barrel would be better for your rifle and that the 6.01 is unnecessary.

[Kiki]

I disagree. For a sniper rifle that will be firing many fewer shots than an AEG, there's no reason to not get a 6.01. As long as you always use high quality BBs, you shouldn't have a problem.

[Nate!!!!]

Ok, I use KSG .30s and my rifle is all stock right now and I was looking for tighter groupings and better accuracy and I will be upgrading the spring to a laylax pss10 150 spring and a better piston and spring guide, do you think this is a good idea? Or something else?

[triggs]

Before you upgrade any spring.

Upgrade the piston and trigger sears. These are always the fastest parts to wear out. They wear out even faster with high tension springs. If you're only after accuracy then avoid FPS upgrades, FPS =/= (does not equal) accuracy. After a certain point FPS does not increase range.

The argument that a 6.03 does better than a 6.01 is relative, there is a very minimal change in accuracy at the ranges any airsoft rifle is capable of. The length of barrel also has a minimal effect on accuracy with any barrel longer than 509mm. If you get say, a Laylax 430mm 6.01mm VSR tightbore you might have very similar accuracy to a Madbull Black Python v2 509mm 6.03mm tightbore.

Since there are very few companies that produce VSR barrels (Laylax and EDGI are the only two that come to mind), you are certainly limited in your choices.

I would start with a new inner barrel/bucking and evaluate the performance changes before even considering modifying the spring. A new cylinder/cylinder head/piston/piston head/spring guide are certainly a good idea as they are durability mods, not accuracy/range improvements.

Be aware however, when considering upgrades that you are upgrading a WELL MB07, while it is technically a clone of the TM VSR-10, many parts may not fit without modification, or they may not fit at all. Most clones have severe compatibility issues. I would recommend if you really want a starter platform that you buy a JG BAR-10, it is a much more compatible VSR-10 clone than the WELL MB-07.

[Nate!!!!]

Thank you triggs that helped me a lot! But the outer barrel is just a little longe than the 515mm barrel in there now so I don't know how a 509mm barrel would work.

[triggs]

The outer barrel serves two purposes. 1. Protect the inner barrel from being bent 2. Stabilize the inner barrel to maintain accuracy.

As long as the outer barrel is longer than the inner barrel anything will be fine. Just remember to use barrel spacers to stabilize the inner barrel inside of the outer to maintain a consistent shot grouping. Basically a 430mm works the same way, as long as it doesn't move around a lot inside the outer barrel you will have good accuracy and a very consistent shot. Obviously the shooter will play a larger role, but the less the inner barrel can move around, the only area that causes inconsistent shots is you as the shooter.

[fuzzywolly]

Jul 21, 2010 23:50:00 GMT -5 Kiki said:

I disagree. For a sniper rifle that will be firing many fewer shots than an AEG, there's no reason to not get a 6.01. As long as you always use high quality BBs, you shouldn't have a problem.

Actually, your accuracy will decrease at longer ranges. There is proof and I can post it up if necessary. But do not go with a 6.01. Its not necessary and actually will decrease accuracy due to the size of the bb.

Edit: Here is an explanation (I did not write this)

Airsoft 201 – The right diameter Tight Bore Barrel.

I have been repeating this a lot lately. I am putting these concepts forward and if someone using Physics come up with a valid reason that it does not work like this and explain why that is. This will be left as written for posterity.

Why and Ideal Tight Bore barrel in Airsoft is ~6.03/6.04mm. Even PDI of Japan says anything tighter then 6.03mm is not good for accuracy and fps in Airsoft.

Okay…as some of you know. Airsoft guns are Blow Guns, not firearms. So stop using firearm physics in trying to make your Airsoft gun shoot more accurately or further.

There is a level of diminishing returns for a TBB. A stock TM barrel is 6.08mm and in the old days, BB’s were also true 6mm. This leaves a .08mm gap and there is a reason for this.

An airsoft gun barrel needs the gap. This will allow air to move around the bb as it travels down the barrel. If the bb is too big and the barrel is too tight, the bb in the barrel starts acting like a plunger. The bb has to push the air out of the barrel as it moves through the barrel. It also has to draw air in behind the bb as it travels down the barrel. In these instances, the bb is being slowed by the air in front and by drawing the air in back. Increase the gap around the bb then the bb moves down the barrel with less resistance from the front and the back.

For those of you that are experienced enough, notice how moving from a 6.08mm bore barrel to a 6.04mm barrel nets a noticeable increase in FPS for s stock TM, the average of ~12fps increase.

However, if you bump it up to .01mm more the FPS only goes up to ~15fps and going down to a 6.01mm barrel the FPS gain goes down to an average of ~10fps (Tests were with 363mm length barrel, type 2 cylinder and ~5.98mm bb’s).

With the effect of pushing and pulling air as a bb travelling down a barrel that is too tight, the additional effect that the bb is subjected to is turbulence within the barrel. This turbulence will make the bb less accurate and slow the bb down even more. This is caused by air trying to move around a bb from the front and from vortices from the rear as air moves in from behind.

And if you notice, the good bb’s now days are roughly 5.95mm…see the magic number? The good bb’s with the ideal TBB barrels around ~6.03mm is roughly .08mm.

TM got it right in the beginning didn’t they?

Now throw in additional factors with undersized cylinders and barrels that are to long. FPS and accuracy will drop even further.

So, can anyone state in physical terms why this would not be true

[Nate!!!!]

Fuzzywolly, I am really glad you posted that it make a lot of sense. And thanks triggs, I was worried about that! Thank you all that helped! It made it a lot easier for me!

[Touchette]

If you're looking for accuracy and range, your best upgrade option is going to be the hopup unit, packing (often incorrectly called bucking), and nub. Those will have a greater affect on range and accuracy than a TBB will.

Other than that the debate between 6.01 & 6.03 has been going for a while and will probably never go away. I'm on the 6.03 bandwagon, because of the logic presented in Fuzzy's post. Either way, it won't matter nearly as much as the hop system and your abilities as the shooter.