Joined: Apr 2004 Gender: Male Posts: 1,179 Location: Charming China Karma: 202
A cheap bastard's guide to airsoft gear - updated! « Thread Started on Jun 17, 2004, 3:03pm »
OK, after having totally freaked myself out by looking at my credit card statement after a month-long splurge on Airsoft guns-n-ammo, I decided to go very cheap on tactical gear. What follows is what I learned when I sought to get gear at the cheapest price possible.
1) Do not cheap out on eye protection. Just don't! You may look at the cost of some goggles and scoff, but when you get popped in the eyeball because you bought a cheap, crappy, no-good sealing brand of goggles, you'll be scared straight. God forbid you actually get hurt in the eye, instead of just crapping your pants because you thought you were blinded. Hell, you can get goggles that'll stop a .22 round for under $100. I have heard some good things about specialty Airsoft goggles which have a dense web of wire over the eyes, instead of shatterproof plastic. The BB's can't get in through the gaps in the mesh, and you don't have any trouble with fogging. They can be pretty cheap. Anyone who knows about these care to comment? EDIT I have used these wire masks in several skirmishes and I like their no-fogging. I sacrificed one and fired many BB's of different types into the eye part a various distances. None of the BB's broke or splintered, but the wire did tend to bend a slight amount. I would recommend replacing a wire mask that has been the victim of too many rounds in the wire part. END EDIT
2) Army surplus stores are your friend. You can get really cheap BDU's and boots and sometimes web gear and vests for reasonable prices at your local Army/Navy surplus store. You may find cheaper prices online, but you can't try any of that on, and shipping ain't free, dagnabbit.
3) Cheaper Than Dirt is your friend. Lots of good stuff there, including a wide variety of foreign BDU's, inexpensive holsters, and some other neato/cheapo gear. There are other surplus retailers out there on the web, too. I've used Minuteman Surplus with positive results for some niche stuff.
4) Surplus gear stinks. Really, it can smell quite musty. I got a Swedish army shoulder rig that smelled like 37 mildewey basements. Take your gear apart and split it up into several pillowcases. Wash in a standard washing machine with regular laundry soap, but before the last rinse cycle, throw in a cup or two of vinegar. Optionally wash again without soap to get rid the vinegar smell.
5) The hardware store is your friend. Go to the local hardware store and wander the aisles. Note that webbing straps, ladders, clips, side buckles, ladderlock buckles and so on can be got for very cheap. I made a custom, left-handed 3-point sling for my AK for less than 5 dollars. Grab some extra silicone lube. An imptomptu Camelbak-style water pouch can be made from aquarium hose, a heavy tarp and some Shoe Goo (OK, probably not a good idea, but you get the point). Improvise and go nuts, it's cheap!
6) The candy store is your friend, also. M&Ms Minis (and now lil' Reeses Pieces Minis) come in a little plastic tube. These are great inexpensive BB holders. They're small enough to fit into pistol mag pouches and hold somewhere around 200 BBs. Pack 'em tight and the BBs won't make any noise rattling around. There's even king-sized tubes too, but they might be too long to fit in a standard mag pouch. Paint them if you want, they tend to be attention-attracting bright colors.
7) Learn to sew. Or get someone who knows how to sew to do it for you. Why? Because you can get inexpensive holsters and things and modify them, that's why! Ten minutes and a needle-n-thread and I made a custom leg holster for my Mac11 large-frame sub-gun out of a 7-dollar nylon jobbie.
Note - if you refuse to sew, nylon webbing or straps can be heated with a lighter or candle until is starts to melt. This can be squished onto another section of nylon webbing for a somewhat secure hold.
8) Respect the duct tape. Hell, bring a roll with you at all times when you're skirmishing. Try wrapping it neatly around a water bottle or BB bottle or something to save space instead of carrying the entire roll. It fixes broken guns, makes temporary straps, sets broken limbs, seals cuts, and can be used to tame wild animals in a pinch. Do not underestimate it's myriad uses!
9) Buy green gas once, and never again. When the original can is empty, head on over to the local smoke shop and buy a butane refill can. Make sure it's one with a universal refill system, or just pop off the cap and check to see whether there are a bunch of plastic tips on the inside of the cap - those are what you want. Then go to the camping section of your local store and pick up one of those small, portable propane canisters, the ones about the size of a 2-liter bottle of pop, only shorter.
Take one of the largest plastic tips and fit the wide end onto your green gas can tip. There should be a flat top with a tiny hole in it. If you want, widen the hole with a pushpin. Put the green gas can in the freezer for 20 minutes. Take it out and place the green gas can on a flat surface. Get your propane canister, flip it upside down, and jam it onto the green gas can's plastic tip, like you were filling a mag. Press together solidly for a minute or so - you should hear the liquid propane rushing into the green gas can. Do not attempt to fill the can all the way or anything like that, it could explode. Just do a little bit at a time. And for pete's sake, do this outside - propane gas stinks really bad and attracts spiders. Also, when you do this, make sure to re-lube your mags frequently by squirting some silicone spray on the seals and down the gas chamber because the propane refills won't have any lube in it. EDIT: Buy the Airsoft Innovations propane adaptor! It's only $30 (available at www.airsoftatlanta.com) and worth every penny. END EDIT
10) Try browsing the aisles of a Salvation Army store. You might get lucky and find camo pants and shirts in your size for like, a buck apiece. Sometimes you can get boots or canteens or ponchos and crap really cheap as well. Hell, why stop there? Garbage picking is a harmless hobby. Try cruising the streets of richer neighborhoods on trash pickup day - you'll be surprised what people throw away.
12) Go halfsies. Starting out and find the prices of things frightening? Split the cost with a friend. If you trust someone, this can work out pretty well. You can get twice the amount of things for the same price! Don't trust them enough to share a vest or whatever? Then go in with them on an order and save on shipping.
And finally...
13) Learn to settle. If you're going to cheap out on gear, be prepared to look like a total scrub. Be happy that you spent less than anyone else.
Joined: Apr 2004 Gender: Male Posts: 1,179 Location: Charming China Karma: 202
Re: A cheap bastard's guide to airsoft gear « Reply #2 on Jun 17, 2004, 3:33pm »
Well, you don't actually use the butane gas for anything. You just need the tips on the can's cap so that you can put the propane can on the green gas can and tranfer the liquid gas without it spraying cryogenic gasses everywhere.
And green gas is propane, just with a small amount of pure silicone oil added to it to keep the mag seals properly lubed.
In fact, if you feel like it, before you start refilling your green gas can, use an unsharp syringe or eyedropper to add a few drops of 10Wt light shock oil (needs to be 100% pure silicone) to the green gas can tip. Refilling the can will push the oil in. Shake 'er up and it's better than new!
Want to know the difference? Propane is FLAMMABLE, Green Gas is NOT. The fluorocarbons and chlorofluorocarbons used as propellent in gas pistols are generally used as refrigerant compounds and inert (non reactive, non-flammable) dusting sprays. (What you thought those gases didn't have a purpose outside airsoft?) I would not want to charge something I was carrying on my person with a flammable gas. Every time you fire a round you are mixing fuel and air very near you. All it would take is a spark to set that mixure off.
Joined: Jan 2003 Gender: Male Posts: 2,046 Location: Channing, MI Karma: 22
Re: A cheap bastard's guide to airsoft gear « Reply #6 on Jun 17, 2004, 7:25pm »
According to posts from DumboRAT on Arnies around a year or so ago he determined that at least a portion of the Green Gas coming into the US was likely Propane. Also that propane really didn't have any notable adverse effects on GBB's except where it's pressure curve differs at higher ambiant temps. So more less it shouldn't hurt your gun to run propane in it, though at higher temps the pressure could be more than the can/mag can withstand and could cause a dangerous enviorment.
Joined: Jan 2003 Gender: Male Posts: 2,046 Location: Channing, MI Karma: 22
Re: A cheap bastard's guide to airsoft gear « Reply #8 on Jun 17, 2004, 7:49pm »
Well the point that DumboRAT made was that since no brands are packaged in the states nor really list composition, we are all guessing what really is in the cans. Though from the people who did some flame tests on several different kinds of green gas available in the states they determined that several brands burned with the same color and intensity as propane in the same device. So to me, and from what people with far more knowledge of gas composition than I, determined that it was far more likely that they had indeed packaged propane in some brands of green gas cans to save on costs.
Joined: Nov 2003 Gender: Male Posts: 242 Location: NEO - Aurora, OH Karma: 1
Re: A cheap bastard's guide to airsoft gear « Reply #9 on Jun 17, 2004, 8:31pm »
Thanks for the info. HFC134a, HFC-22, and the molecular formula listed for Green Gas in the primer shouldn't burn in air. Kind of lame that they package propane as Green gas, I'd rather power my gun with a non reactive propellant....
Re: A cheap bastard's guide to airsoft gear « Reply #10 on Jun 17, 2004, 8:39pm »
Oddly enough, 134a is a refrigerant gas...not sure exactly what it's used for (I would assume as a Freon [R22] replacement).
As it may be, 134a is considerably more environment-friendly than HFC-22/green gas.
Back on-topic: I wouldn't trust my eyes to a pair of wire-mesh goggles, especially with a sniper rifle on the field. Yeah, they may stop a bb, but there's a chance of bb fragmentation, and I'm sure small pieces of a bb entering your eye are just as dangerous as if the whole bb were to hit you.
Cheaperthandirt is a great place to shop for BDUs, especially flecktarn, and alpenflage when they have it.
Another thing to remember is that the "real" gear isn't as expensive as you think. A BHI vest can be had for a bit over a hundred bucks, and many of the "high end" modular setups start around a hundred bucks...the TT MAV and SOTech Hellcat come to mind here...and both come with a lifetime guarantee in addition to their nigh-on indestructible build. If you start with a modular setup, and add pouches as you can afford them, it actually becomes quite easy to amass a solid, multipurpose rig.
Just remember, being "cheap" (I prefer thrifty, or cost-conscious) doesn't always mean buying the least expensive stuff you can find.
Joined: Apr 2004 Gender: Male Posts: 1,179 Location: Charming China Karma: 202
Re: A cheap bastard's guide to airsoft gear « Reply #11 on Jun 17, 2004, 8:55pm »
I was intrigued and put some butane in my fantastically cheap gas NBB (strictly for plinking, it's really bad). In short, it doesn't have any power. The bb's lurch out of the gun at a pathetic rate and go maybe 10 feet before falling, even .12's.
So forget butane as a gas gun propellant.
Thanks for the tips about how inexpensive even good gear can be. My experiences with buying tactical gear on a restricted budget was more an exersize in creativity. You know, is it even possible to get a decent setup for less than 50 dollars all told? [As it turns out, yes: flecktarn shirt and pants, $20; drop leg holster modified for MAC11, $7; 3-point sling, $3.50; surplus shoulder harness with pouches, $9.50; plus shipping and thread comes to about $50. Goggles not included!]
In the long run, I know I'll succumb and buy a nice modular rig, but that credit card bill from gun purchases had me so scared I got all reactionary.
Joined: Jan 2003 Gender: Male Posts: 2,046 Location: Channing, MI Karma: 22
Re: A cheap bastard's guide to airsoft gear « Reply #12 on Jun 17, 2004, 8:55pm »
Just as a side note on the use of HFC134a, it's whats currently used for automotive air conditioning, so:) If you check in the automotive area of your local walmart the new conversion kits for older R12 airconditioning systems is switching the coolant to 134a, which you can pick up in pure form by the can in the same place. Which if you were so inclined would be a decent source of pure 134a which should be slightly better than duster for airsoft guns.
Luke
EDIT: For anyone confused we hadn't spoke about butane as a propellant just using the adapters from the can's. So in other words butane will not provide enough propellant to get a decent velocity.
Those who swear by armalites have never owned an AK
Joined: Sept 2003 Gender: Male Posts: 625 Location: Channing MI Karma: 2
Re: A cheap bastard's guide to airsoft gear « Reply #14 on Jun 18, 2004, 5:20pm »
that "impromptu camelbak" is not a very good idea, the labor involved to make it work and keep it watertight is easily worth the $15-20 you pay for a knock-off or one that's on sale at a sporting goods store or the $10 you pay for 2 1 qt. canteens at a surplus store.
Not to mention that shoegoo is poisonous and if you screw up somewhere you could very well end up in the hospital